2G18 - 5: Taxes (and death)

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 4:53 pm

Getting to be that time of year. At least for me, because I do them as soon as I get my W2, which is generally end of January/ early February.

So how about taxes? Do you have to file them or does your socialist country take care of that for you? If you file them, when do you have to file them by and how much effort do you put into it? Do you typically do them early or are you generally filing right up against the due date? Do you pretty much just fill out a few simple form boxes or is it an excruciating process of going through various records, receipts, and forms from various institutions for you? Do you do them yourself or do you get some aid like an accountant or maybe use some software?

How do you feel about taxes? Both in the particular sense as it affects you directly and in the general sense of their role in society? Do you usually get a refund or owe money and how does that affect the way you feel about filing them? How do you feel about the way they are used or should be used? For those who don't need to file taxes, does that mean no deductions exist for any life circumstances, and how do you feel about that? If the only certainties in life are death and taxes would losing LPTDW be worth it to escape the latter? And speaking of death and taxed, how about that estate tax?

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 6:31 pm

Not self-employed, so don't do taxes!

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:04 pm

How does that work though? Do things like children affect your taxes and if so is your boss supposed to know all that stuff?

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:06 pm

No idea. Isn't a problem I have to deal with. I'm guessing it's the duty of HR departments and HMRC.

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:08 pm

Do you have to file them or does your socialist country take care of that for you?

I have to file them. I wish Canada was more socialist, dammit! I get the impression our taxes are considerably less painful than those in the US, though. Although one fun aspect of living in Quebec is that they do everything differently from the other Canadian provinces, including their provincial taxes!

If you file them, when do you have to file them by and how much effort do you put into it?

By the end of April. I try to use whatever reasonably cheap software will allow me to do them as painlessly as possible. (Hopefully the whole process for me and Chelsea is one evening--ideally just a couple hours, but something always goes wrong with the software or something.)

Do you typically do them early or are you generally filing right up against the due date?

Typically I do them right near the end of April, or even late. We are planning to do them early this year, as it's possible we could owe money.

Do you pretty much just fill out a few simple form boxes or is it an excruciating process of going through various records, receipts, and forms from various institutions for you?

It's mostly some form boxes. In fact, the Canada Revenue Agency has been better recently at making it possible to auto-fill many of the fields in various software based on current and past income slips. It wasn't the smoothest process last year, but I'm hoping I have an easier time with that this year.

Do you do them yourself or do you get some aid like an accountant or maybe use some software?

Myself, but with software that's available online.

How do you feel about taxes? Both in the particular sense as it affects you directly and in the general sense of their role in society?

They're important, and one of the biggest problems in society is that there are too many ways to avoid paying them, especially for the people/corporations that ought to be paying the most. I'm fine with being taxed. It would be nice if there was a smoother process that didn't require this annual "correction", but god knows how you'd set that up.

Do you usually get a refund or owe money and how does that affect the way you feel about filing them?

I've always had a refund, including last year's 2016 taxes, which included almost half a year of working at a job that actually puts me into a taxable bracket. That's because I had income tax deducted, but only worked that job for 5 months of 2016, so my total income was well below what I was being taxed for. I hadn't considered that, so it was kind of sweet.

This year I'm not sure what to expect. Depends on how well my payroll deductions match what I should actually be taxed, I guess! Though I do have a bunch of tuition credits stocked up from way too many years in postsecondary school, so it's possible I can still reduce what I owe to zero, if I do owe.

Anyway, whatever it is, I get paid enough not to whine about it.

How do you feel about the way they are used or should be used?

Well, we live in a complicated society where they're obviously going to be spent on all sorts of things I'll never make use of. I don't see the problem with that. They also get used to maintain infrastructure I obviously make great use of, and to provide me and everybody else with healthcare and education. Frankly, I think a lot more things should be run by the government even if that means higher taxes. Also, people who act like "taxation is theft" are fucking idiots. Oh yeah, I guess we should just let the wonderful, caring market handle everything? Because, you know, obviously everything on Earth should turn a profit.

Anyway, I obviously would like to be represented by a government that spends my tax money on more things I care about, but democracy (and beyond that, just society broadly) means it won't be tailored exactly to me. Obviously I could also do without government employees flagrantly spending tax dollars on their vacations and shit like that.

For those who don't need to file taxes, does that mean no deductions exist for any life circumstances, and how do you feel about that?

Sadly not applicable.

If the only certainties in life are death and taxes would losing LPTDW be worth it to escape the latter?

No. Death is scary. Taxes I can cope with.

And speaking of death and taxes, how about that estate tax?

It's not something I've put a lot of thought into, but thinking about it now, I'm ok with the principle of it, even as someone who has benefited from inheritance. There's too much money-hoarding going on in general in society, and that's one way to free some of it up. But I understand why it rankles people.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:09 pm

So basically you have no deductions, so you don't have to deal with it, but they may exist. That's close to me in the sense that I generally just do the standard deduction and fill my stuff out lickety split but I do have to fill it out.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:14 pm

I have deductions and they come out of my pay automatically. I never see the money but there's a record of what I get paid. Sometimes, I over pay and there's usually a rebate. For example, I was being taxed on a year of my London salary. I stop working for a month then start temping and making below the taxable threshold a week. After a couple of weeks, I start being due tax back, so rather than pay tax, I'm given extra money. One particularly poor week earlier this month, my tax rebate was higher than my earnings of the week.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:15 pm

So you get tax rebates on a weekly basis? Nice!

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:23 pm

Weekly + automatic does sound better.

Damien · Post by **Damien** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:24 pm

I get paid weekly because I'm a temporary worker for an agency that does a weekly payroll. Would be monthly if I had a normal, monthly-paid job.

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 7:27 pm

Still sounds better than the big annual correction we do in Canada and the US.

Mitsurugi CP · Post by **Mitsurugi CP** » Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:21 pm

Do you have to file them or does your socialist country take care of that for you?

My capitalist society has elected officials that take legal bribes from H&R Block and TurboTax to needlessly complicate the entire process.

If you file them, when do you have to file them by and how much effort do you put into it?

Sometime in mid-April. I don't know the specific date anymore, but I always file everything by the end of February. Dad is an accountant, and does the whole family's taxes every year.

Do you pretty much just fill out a few simple form boxes or is it an excruciating process of going through various records, receipts, and forms from various institutions for you?

While dad helps with the final filing, we itemize deductions because home ownership and investments.

How do you feel about taxes?

If we want to live in a society and not a Randian anarchy, we need to collectively agree on providing certain goods, services, and oversight in the interest of the general public, and taxation is essentially the price of that society. The greater a society's means, the greater the moral imperative to advance the public good without relying on profit-driven motivators.

I'm going to be in a higher tax bracket this year than I have been previously, but what I earn is partially the result of the society in which I live. It has provided the safety, education, stability, and opportunities that have helped me get to where I am now. I do feel obligated to pay that back. I do feel like I should be paying more and, likewise, those who earn substantially more than me, because their success is also a result of economic and social forces shaped by a society from which they benefit exorbitantly.

I like how a lot of taxes are spent, I also don't like how a lot of taxes are spent, same as anyone. As a general rule, I don't like the increasing trend of unnecessary subsidies and tax cuts that benefit an extremely privileged economic minority, to the detriment of everyone else. Generally, I like taxes that go towards ensuring fairness, justice, and a basic standard of living for all citizens.

And yeah, anyone who says taxation is theft is the same group of John Birch Society hypocrites that venerate the US constitution while being wholly ignorant of the concept of representative democracy, or who call themselves "sovereign citizens", but somehow struggle with the concept of property rights when it has anything to do with the history of the US taking Native American land.

Calbrena · Post by **Calbrena** » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:42 pm

Lord Golbez wrote:Getting to be that time of year. At least for me, because I do them as soon as I get my W2, which is generally end of January/ early February.

So how about taxes? Do you have to file them or does your socialist country take care of that for you? If you file them, when do you have to file them by and how much effort do you put into it? Do you typically do them early or are you generally filing right up against the due date? Do you pretty much just fill out a few simple form boxes or is it an excruciating process of going through various records, receipts, and forms from various institutions for you? Do you do them yourself or do you get some aid like an accountant or maybe use some software?

How do you feel about taxes? Both in the particular sense as it affects you directly and in the general sense of their role in society? Do you usually get a refund or owe money and how does that affect the way you feel about filing them? How do you feel about the way they are used or should be used? For those who don't need to file taxes, does that mean no deductions exist for any life circumstances, and how do you feel about that? If the only certainties in life are death and taxes would losing LPTDW be worth it to escape the latter? And speaking of death and taxed, how about that estate tax?

I received my W2 a few days ago but still haven't looked into it. As I was self-employed for ~half of the year it also complicates the matter a little bit.

The US tax system is ridiculously complex. In Singapore I was done in like 3 clicks. When I was self-employed in the UK it was easier too, despite the fact there were tax deductible things to take into account in both cases.

How much is your local tax % on cremation and burial services by the way? And on coffins?

Regarding the use of taxes, as I've been employed in the public sector at some point, I really hate the way many resources are absolutely wasted in stupid ways. At the same time, there are critical sectors which can't be run exclusively in a "for profit" way, so tax collection is a necessary evil. The key is to redistribute the peas in a way that fits my world view.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:48 pm

My local what? I... don't know that. But it certainly puts a little more in the death category.

Calbrena · Post by **Calbrena** » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:53 pm

Tax on one's estate is one thing, but I bet the VAT rate on just dying and taking care of the logistics of it is absolutely unfair. If you're poor and you die, it's still potentially going to cost your relatives some money they don't have.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:54 pm

That's true. Then again, even without taxes the funeral costs would do that.

Calbrena · Post by **Calbrena** » Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:56 pm

It's adding insult to injury, I suppose.

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:09 pm

I got my T4 slips in the mail. Multiple because I was taxed as an Ontario employee for part of 2017 and as a Québec employee for the other part. I do not know what prompted the change. (I live in Montréal but my job is based in Toronto, hence there being any question about this at all.)

RDM · Post by **RDM** » Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:28 pm

The RDM did his taxes for last year and was rather disappointed. He thought he was going to get money. He did not get money.

At least it wasn't the travesty of 2016, when he wound up owing a giant pile of money. This was a very small pile of money.

He got his first Trump tax break paycheck this week, too. Hooray for essentially no extra money.

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:50 pm

Did you at least get the Paul Ryan Special, $1.50 per week?

eightman · Post by **eightman** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 3:34 am

Lord Golbez wrote:Getting to be that time of year. At least for me, because I do them as soon as I get my W2, which is generally end of January/ early February.

So how about taxes? Do you have to file them or does your socialist country take care of that for you?

We have to file our own taxes.

If you file them, when do you have to file them by and how much effort do you put into it? Do you typically do them early or are you generally filing right up against the due date?

Personal income taxes are due at the end of April. Similarly, corporate income taxes are due 4 months after tax year end.

Do you pretty much just fill out a few simple form boxes or is it an excruciating process of going through various records, receipts, and forms from various institutions for you? Do you do them yourself or do you get some aid like an accountant or maybe use some software?

The more you got going on, the more complicated the filing. I generally use Studio Tax, which is free software and makes all the fiddly filling in of boxes a lot easier. Just punch in all your income and deductions and then it tallies.

2017 has gotten a lot more complicated. I have to sort out taxable benefits, work car, investment income, shareholder income, salary, etc. This time I think I'll hand it off to the accountant.

How do you feel about taxes? Both in the particular sense as it affects you directly and in the general sense of their role in society? Do you usually get a refund or owe money and how does that affect the way you feel about filing them? How do you feel about the way they are used or should be used? For those who don't need to file taxes, does that mean no deductions exist for any life circumstances, and how do you feel about that? If the only certainties in life are death and taxes would losing LPTDW be worth it to escape the latter? And speaking of death and taxed, how about that estate tax?

Taxes are necessary, but I don't believe in paying more than my fair share. I operate on the general principle of individual benefit maximization and that others generally operate on a similar level. Therefore, if I can find a legal advantage, I will take it as I consider myself as operating on the same playing ground where others may have similar opportunities to grasp or alternative opportunities.

The only part of taxation that chokes me up a little bit around here is how it can be unfairly applied to people using services. So many parachute families here where the breadwinner(s) declare non-residency or give up their citizenship after they get their family over here and settled. Then they go back to earn $$$ overseas with income that is not taxed here since they are not citizens or residents. Then, their family is on-paper poor as hell, collecting welfare and other social benefits and subsidies, while using their foreign visa or mastercard that gets paid off overseas, and accepting huge financial gifts wired in from overseas. Essentially they get to live like kings, pay no income tax, and have everyone else who is earning here subsidizing their lifestyle. Our tax laws have enough holes to let this happen and it makes no sense that it is permitted for so long.

As to how taxes are used, I find that they are often wasted on a lot of bloat, overhead, and general political abuse. But, I am aware that the choice is usually for the least-shitty system rather than the best system.

Probate fees are what we have here for estate taxes, and they're fairly minimal (0.6 to 1.4%) and even those are fairly easy to avoid if you don't think your children are going to try to destroy you once they have access to your money.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 4:28 am

I just did my taxes today. I didn't get my W2 in the mail but I was able to look it up online and fill it out. Got a decent refund coming.

smeared ink wrote:Did you at least get the Paul Ryan Special, $1.50 per week?

I got a bit more than that.

Vibing_V · Post by **Vibing_V** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 5:28 am

My taxes are very simple usually. I haven't owed anything thus far - usually getting nice carbon credits and things.

BC is still bonkers for charging MSP as a separate entity and not having it rolled into taxes, though. WTF.

I used to use QuickTax. Now use StudioTax. Same thing, different package. It makes things easy. I'm also very happy that e-file is a thing.

Sometimes I file late, but legally I'm allowed to because I don't owe them, they owe me. Haven't run into any issues with it aside from MSP trying to wrongly back charge me as some sort of stupid punishment recently.

I like the idea of a big pot of contributions funding important things like infrastructure and social services. Not necessarily with the governments and how they handle everything. But I agree with the socialist aspect of taxes.

The only thing I think really ought to change is the year-end adjustment as someone else mentioned. I haven't had to deal with it personally, but I know other people who have and it becomes an "unexpected" expense (sure, poor planning and whatnot - but if they're making deductions anyway why can't they do a better job of it? I dunno).

RDM · Post by **RDM** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 10:37 am

The RDM got slightly more than the Paul Ryan special. Wasn't enough to make an actual difference in anything, though.

He's starting to think that next year he'd be better served filing separately from his wife. Load up all the deductions he can on one side so he can beat the standard deduction while taking said standard deduction on the other side. Seems like that would work better.

Mitsurugi CP · Post by **Mitsurugi CP** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:51 pm

RDM wrote:The RDM got slightly more than the Paul Ryan special. Wasn't enough to make an actual difference in anything, though.

Sounds like someone doesn't have a Costco membership.

RDM · Post by **RDM** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:54 pm

We don't have Costco here.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:34 pm

RDM wrote:The RDM got slightly more than the Paul Ryan special. Wasn't enough to make an actual difference in anything, though.

He's starting to think that next year he'd be better served filing separately from his wife. Load up all the deductions he can on one side so he can beat the standard deduction while taking said standard deduction on the other side. Seems like that would work better.

If you can get all the deductions for kids and such it might work, but remember the standard deduction for filing jointly is more. On the ither hand, you might get into lower marginal tax brackets if you file separately too.

RDM · Post by **RDM** » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:46 pm

The standard deduction for married couples is double what it is for an individual. If he piles up itemized deductions on one side (not sure if you actually can do that...) it would probably work out. As it is, being a New Yorker with two pieces of property, the RDM gets screwed by the new cap on State and Local tax deductions.

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Tue Feb 27, 2018 12:58 am

Woo just filed taxes! The Netfile option in Québec only opened today. Easily my earliest ever.

Also, because I'd been carrying tuition credits forward for years and now finally have tax to reduce, I used em all up and am getting a sweet return! This is coinciding with my annual work bonus. So what I'm saying is: now's the time to visit and be treated to drinks.

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:24 am

I already received my tax refund for both federal and state!

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:02 pm

Yay refund! Did you gamble it all away yet

Lord Golbez · Post by **Lord Golbez** » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:45 pm

I don't gamble. On rare occasions I may buy a lottery ticket if it gets really high like 500 million, but it's not gambling if you know you won't win.

Fei Ayanami · Post by **Fei Ayanami** » Tue Feb 27, 2018 9:08 pm

Nope it's just a charitable donation then

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2G18 - 5: Taxes (and death)

2G18 - 5: Taxes (and death)

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Re: 2G18 - 5: Taxes (and death)

Re: 2G18 - 5: Taxes (and death)